Submitted by dreamshade on May 19, 2004 - 17:31
The WCCA is open for business again. Nominations for the 2004 awards will be open through June 6.
by Uncle Ghastly - 05/19/2004 - 17:38
I wonder who will win the awards for Best Megatokyo Comic, Best Sluggy Freelance Comic, and Best Penny Arcade Comic this year.
by Al - 05/19/2004 - 17:54
by CalamityJon - 05/19/2004 - 18:55
I take it that the community at large doesn't feel all-that-great an enthusiasm for these awards ...
by RPin - 05/19/2004 - 19:33
Heh. I read somewhere else that the lowly webcartoonists are displeased with the WCCA's in the way that it favors the big guys of the industry. So a Webcomics Sundance Festival may be on its way.
www.alexandilia.com.br is my site.
by John Troutman - 05/19/2004 - 20:33
I'm gonna second that dubious "yay?"
It'll be slightly more enthusiastic on my part should I actually win something. But that's just because I'm a publicity whore.
by Willie_G - 05/19/2004 - 20:46
Well, you know, maybe if we all register to vote we can counter-balance the Penny Arcade Army.
So lets all register and vote for me.
by Willie_G - 05/19/2004 - 20:50
In fact, I just did so.
by Erik Melander - 05/19/2004 - 20:50
I'm not sure it would be correct to lable it as a lack of enthusiasm, but the WCC awards has recieved a farily substantial amount of critisism.
The WCCA is democtatic in nature, anyone who has a webcomic can be nominate and vote. The 4 or 5 comics that get the most nominations for one of the awards goes on to a voting round.
The more popular a webcomic is the more nominations it gets and so Mac Hall, Megatokyo and a few others tend to appear in very many of the categories, some would say on the expense of other more deserving comics. Worth noting is that whereas the popular comics may have dominated the nomination round, they did not (IMO) win as many of the awards as could be expected.
My personal pet peeve with the WCCA are the award categories. IMO they are a bit jumbled, there are awards I don't think is very relevant like outstanding website design outstanding anthopomorphic comic and outstanding gaming comic.
by m_estrugo - 05/19/2004 - 21:44
I don't know if you've checked their awards page. They've added a few more categories. :)
by Freak - 05/19/2004 - 22:45
As far as I could tell, Sluggy Freelance has only gotten two nominations total (though, as far as I've seen, Pete doesn't seem to campaign much as far as any award system goes); Penny Arcade got several nominations last year, but hadn't been nominated previously.
It would probably be more accurate to replace those two with some of CRFH, Fans, It's Walky, or Chopping Block.
by Willie_G - 05/20/2004 - 02:42
I think you're all missing the important thing here:
Registering to vote.
Then voting for me in every category.
by dreamshade - 05/20/2004 - 10:07
My personal pet peeve is that anyone with a webcomic can nominate comics. Not just vote on comics, but nominate them. Since the vast majority of webcomic creators read 1) the popular stuff and 2) the stuff that they and their friends do, most comics that deserve it won't make it into the nominations. If the lesser known stuff could get nominated, that could get people to take a read and vote for the final. That Nowhere Girl won last year was certainly an upset. I would much rather see the nominations given out by a select academy of... I dunno, 100 select artists and authors, people who really keep tabs on other webcomics, and then let the public at large vote on those choices. That would give the award a lot more credence.
You know what we need? A primary election. Comixpedia itself should hold its' own nominations process, post the top three comics for every category that their readers voted on, and then ask every one of those readers to stuff the nominations box with those comics rather than their own personal choices. That'd teach Howard Dean.
by Uncle Ghastly - 05/20/2004 - 15:01
There is very little in one's life that is "the best one can do". There is always room for improvement. It is merely a matter of wether or not one recognizes one's need and room for improvement and wether one is so motivated to improve.
by dreamshade - 05/20/2004 - 15:56
by dreamshade - 05/20/2004 - 17:03
Y'know, the Webby Awards hand out two separate awards: one presented and voted on by the Academy, and a People's Choice Award voted on by everyone. I think that's really what I'd like to see with the awards, to see an additional award given out not just by people who "care" but specifically by people who watch a lot of what goes on in the "industry," who see a wider variety of what shows up on the market and who know what deserves to be noticed. And who have the scruples to know when to nominate the popular comic anyway when it deserves its audience.
Of course, if you don't want to hear the whining about the awards, this probably isn't the place to hang around. There's certainly no lack of controversy around here, and anything popular is going to rub people wrong one way or the other. If people are truly tired of the popular comics winning, there's another way to keep those comics from getting awards, by getting those comic artists to specifically request not to be nominated. Now, I don't know if you'd get someone like Ishida to take his nomination off, but I bet that if you complained at Gallagher enough, he'd feel sorry for everyone else and give in to demands. Having used 'pedia for so much shameless advertising already, I won't whine about my own works so much, but if we actually want an award that competes with the WCCA, maybe we should get Xerexes to set something up.
Of course, we have yet to see the nominations for this year as it is. Who knows? The voter turnout may be completely different than in years past, especially since the awards hasn't been given as much attention as it had in recent years. Should be interesting to see which direction it goes in.
by damonk13 - 05/20/2004 - 17:11
Here's the problem with electing an academy:
Who decides who is "eligible" to be on this academy? In other words, who decides who has "intelligence and taste" to decide *objectively*? Who dictates what IS intelligence or taste when it comes to webcomic? To be the one to mastermind such a thing takes a LOT of thick skin, and a fair bit of arrogance or quixotic bent.
That said, I've always been a fan of a juried system; in fact, for the last two years, I've been working behind the scenes to lobby for and organize just such a thing, even while working on the WCCA committee.
However, I don't think we have 100 readers out there -- much less 20 or so -- who I'd consider being well-versed in webcomics at the moment. Hell, once upon a time, *I* used to be considered one of the most versed, and I can tell you right now that even then I was fully aware that I did not know ENOUGH of what's out there...
Essentially, we have a LOT of hobbyists and laymen, and then we have a handful of mildly-involved readers. In terms of serious students of the medium, we really don't have any -- mostly because of time and/or priority constraints.
I actually had a pseudo-list of potential jury-members at one time, and had been drafting out policy for a jury system, but I can tell you that if I had gone through with it, we'd have gotten as much (if not more) flak as the WCCA does for its democratic process. No matter *how* good or bad the system proved to be.
Bottom line: you can't make everyone happy, no matter how hard you try.
But you CAN try hard to stick with one chosen direction, and work on improving yourself year after year, so that you'll have less and less UNhappy people as time passes.
This is what the WCCA is doing, and I hope that they don't give up anytime soon. They may need a lot of work still, but like it or not, they're the best awards event webcomics has had to date, in my humble opinion.
But if someone wants to give it a go, and is willing to take the time to develop it (and by "take the time", I mean at LEAST a year or two -- don't rush into it, or you'll definitely be shooting yourself in the foot), then I say kudos, and wish them the best.
by rkm0001 - 05/20/2004 - 17:41
Why is it the WCCA always inspires so much angst and griping? It's not one person nominates and selects the winners - if people took part, the comics they want to win might do so - and if not, oh well.
As for the "same comics" winning over and over - well, they get the most votes. People like them the best. Their creators also usually work their asses off nonstop to get them to the state their in.
It's like no one in the webcomics community can ever be happy for anyone else. There's always got to be screaming of how it's unfair.
*eagerly awaits the typical Comixpedia anonymous snarky posts*
by Uncle Ghastly - 05/20/2004 - 20:10
In my case it's not so much angst and griping as it is amusment. I can't see any reason to get upset over the WCCA, it's not like they actually mean anything. The average webcomic artist is a highschool teenager so it's not surprising the results of a webcomic artists only voting system is going to be slanted the way it is. If the WCCA actually was a meaningful award given out by a prestigious panel of respected industry types then I could see getting upset over it.
To me it's like watching people argue about wether the Hulk could beat up Superman, which is amusing in and of itself but nothing to get upset over.
by Xaviar Xerexes - 05/20/2004 - 22:03
I'm happy for ya RKM! :)
I run this place! Tip the piano player on the way out.
by dreamshade - 05/20/2004 - 22:49
Which is why I think it would be a good idea to have both a jury-elected award and a general-public-elected award. If you can't please everyone all at once, then please them separately. As for the number 100, that was arbitrary, but point made anyhow.
Does it take arrogance to decide who is right to be on the jury? I dunno. Before one of the 'pedia regulars submits an article calling popular comic X a bunch of self-righteous trash, does he go around and ask everyone else what they think and change his mind if everyone disagrees with him? Who are the guys who vote on the Origins Awards (card games, RPG's, etc.)? Are they the biggest bunch of elitists or what? If you approach the task with arrogance, if you say "This award was given out by the best authors and writers of the net and represents the absolute pinnacle of yadda yadda yadda," then people will call bullshit on you. But if you approach it with respect and honest interest, if you say "This award was given out by a select jury of artists and writers who wish to congratulate the creator for their achievements," then most people will also show some respect for it. After all, the awards were created as a means of giving credence and attention to webcomics, not to spark a dick war amongst artists. ...Right?
Which is not to disrespect the WCCA in any way. I find it interesting to see what gets nominated because there are always things in there that I've never seen before. But in those terms of getting the word out, I'd like to see what else is out there, and I think a jury-offered award might get more interest from outside the webcomic community, especially if you could rope in a few people who are usually more interested in print comics to serve jury time. I think that's a better view to have than "So who's going to win the Best Penny Arcade Award this year?"
by RPin - 05/20/2004 - 22:52
Why do I have this feeling I just dug up my own hole? I couple of news below I just posted a message about how unrelevant the Oscars are because they do not reflect the best of the movie industry.
I can understand how hard it must be to run an Award Committe. Probably because I know, no matter what the responsibles for the WCCA do, there will always be someone whinning. Maybe it's time for the WCCA to take a look at itself and ask "am I really giving the recognizement the best webcomics deserve"? If the answer is yes, then I don't see why there's a reason to listen to all the complaints, specially from people that do not have interest in this award because they know they're not going to make into it.
by dreamshade - 05/20/2004 - 22:53
Hey, don't worry. I've read that comic that Anonymous does, and it's complete and total shit, so his opinion in worthless.
by Willie_G - 05/21/2004 - 02:30
I'm registered. I have no idea how to vote yet, but I'm registered.
Do I have to enter a small curtained room and pull a switch? Oh wait, that's how I get the strippers to dance behind the glass for me...
by Willie_G - 05/21/2004 - 02:35
Ladies and Germs...
All voting works the same way. If you don't want Penny Arcade to sweep this year, try to register to vote for something else. *AHEMmeHEM*
It's the same way you can get President Shrub out of office in November.
And I think I read in the Penny Arcade blog that they're funded by Al-Qaeda... so you know you just GOTTA vote now.
by Ben Gamboa - 05/21/2004 - 23:34
I don't know why there's all this concern about Penny Arcade sweeping, as they've only won a grand total of one award out of the past three ceremonies (in fact, until last year, they didn't receive any nominations at all). If anything, I think their popularity might be working against them; perhaps some folks are hesitant to vote for them, regardless of whether they're more deserving, because it means losing an opportunity to spotlight a lesser-known comic.
by Willie_G - 05/22/2004 - 00:06
Sluggy Freelance is also funded by Al Qaeda.
by Boxjam B. Boxjam - 05/23/2004 - 16:15
>>I don't know why there's all this concern about Penny Arcade sweeping, as they've only won a grand total of one award out of the past three ceremoni-
Penny Arcade declined all nominations until last year.
Nevertheless, the larger point that there are no perennials in the WCCA's is true.
by Anonymous - 05/20/2004 - 14:07
They're the best we can do.
Then make your own and prove me wrong.
by Anonymous - 05/20/2004 - 16:36
There is some truth to that. Actually, there's a lot of truth to that.
It's just that I know some of the process that's gone into these awards, and I resent the way they seem to be dismissed as "let's vote on what's popular again!" They're created and voted upon by people who care.
I was three-quarters serious in my invitation above. I would like to see someone try to compete with the CCAs. At the very least, the competition would create additional pressure toward quality.
by Anonymous - 05/20/2004 - 16:38
Then please send me a link to your efforts at email@example.com. I'd like to see 'em.
by Anonymous - 05/20/2004 - 18:04
I just thought it was funny when they had the award for best use of "digital art" last year, and IIRC, ALL FIVE of the nominees were cut-n-paste comics. Photoshop, Painter, and Illustrator have plenty of features other than "CTRL-C/CTRL-V", ya know!
At least the award went to the one guy in web comics who uses cut-n-paste well, so I'll give them that.
Anyway, whatever. I was really whiny about the awards last year, and I don't know why. My main problem is that I really don't see the need for these. Nobody but other webcartoonists pay attention to these awards, and they're just as arbitrary and meaningless as the Grammys, Oscars, and all other awards shows. The only thing they seemed to accomplish in the past is creating more resentment, and don't we have enough of that in webcomics already?
by Anonymous - 05/21/2004 - 12:43
You suck Milholland! You suck with the suck of a thousand suckers with automated sucking machines set to suck-a-matic on the suckingest hour of the suckingest day of the suckingest month of the suckingest year on a planet of suck orbiting a black hole of ultimate suckage. You may also be teh ghey.
(Not Ghastly, really)
ComixTalk is not responsible for comments, blog and forum posts. ComixTalk stories and articles are copyright by their respective authors.